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Re: LESSON: Don't try to lie. It doesn't go well. I wish there was a 'like' button....
September 19, 2012, 08:11:08 PM HST
1
Re: The Truth About Aloha I didn't really want to comment on this, and most staff probably won't, but I got dragged into this mess, so let's just get this over with.  I'll try to be as concise as possible while addressing the actual points, but still thorough, as to not be accused of..  well, hopefully, anything at all.  most of you probably know by now that I don't partake in the community a great deal, so hopefully you can take this as an unbiased response.

also, while I can't believe I even have to say it, I'll say it anyways;  these are my opinions, and this is my response.  it is not to be interpreted as representative the staff as a whole. (even though it might be worded that way.. vOv)

Quote from: Monstarules
Firstly, we haven't bothered to expand to any other games. [...] We never were aggressive with the other games that we went into and expanded into, and the support for the games dropped like flies since it wasn't Ace of Spades.

this is sadly true, though from my point of view of one as the people that wants to "cling" to Ace of Spades, it isn't that it's not AoS, but a number of other factors such as how easy it is to transition over to the new game, server hosting difficulties, the community of the game in question and a few other things.  I realize this is just an exaggerated statement to get a point across, but I wanted to address it anyways, so there you have it.
(the rest of the paragraph was obvious to everyone so I cut it out)

Quote from: Monstarules
Secondly, the staff of this website is broken, and in some cases corrupt. I can affirm from being a staff member that there are people who cause issues who are still staff since they're considered "Veterans". Basically nobody gets a fresh scope, which is why Guards are always getting beat up, even if an older staff member does the exact same thing.

I'll agree with the somewhat vague statement "guards are getting beaten up" as it's so vague, and because I agree (mostly) with israelleelll.
as for the rest, evidence, please.  you're leaking info now anyways (more on that later), so naming some names and sharing some stories probably won't hurt.  at the very least you can give the people involved a chance to defend themselves.

Quote from: Monstarules
Also, there are instances where the staff would go out and call up inactive staff to trash applications for Trusted and Guard. I personally witnessed trashing of Trusted applications, and I was told by multiple admins, AND 2 BK'S, that staff applications suffer the same problems, especially guard ones. You know how they filibuster stuff in the government?  They basically do that and gather inactive staff who don't care for Aloha to vote on the application, often drawing upon age old issues that are no longer concurrent with whats happening now.

I went through all of the trusted apps and staff apps and I can't find a single piece of evidence for this "they" calling on others to trash applications.  ...or did you specifically mean Komrades?
we might bring up old issues, but just remember, the application system is run by humans, not machines.  you have to work to gain our trust, and if you break that, you're going have to work even harder to get it back.  even with that in mind, the people involved almost always handle things fairly, if things are shown to be different the next time around.

Quote from: Monstarules
Also, they don't look at your trusted applications at all if they don't know you. Yeah. There are literally hundreds of people who needed trusted who lost it because the staff "Didn't know them". There are also cases where staff members will purposely go after someone they don't like, and argue with you to make you look like an asshole so they can trash your application. Unrelated, but a good portion of the staff belong to the same clan and friend group.

can you really blame us?  unless you are insane, you wouldn't let any one come into a position of power (yes, trusted counts) unless you knew them to be a good person, who wouldn't abuse it.  this is just common sense, man.
as for the "going after someone" part, I have to disagree on the larger scale.  there might be one or two instances where this happened, as we're all human after all, but the application system as a whole is carried out with integrity.  if we ask people questions, they're fair, or at least supposed to be, those 'instances' in mind.

Quote from: Monstarules
Oh and how do I know that there are staff who actively cooperate to trash Guard apps? Easy! There are BKs and admins who told me my entire application word for word and post by post. Getting someone to vote on an application is necessary sometimes, but some people completely trash applications because of personal vendettas. It's happened to more than one person too, especially in trusted apps.

so wait, it was "staff are unfairly ganging up and denying apps to everyone equally" and now it's "staff are unfairly ganging up and denying my application"?
as a side note, that app leaking is a serious thing, and maybe you should be the better man and "report" the person who did that.  or was it one of the Bastards, and you're too nice to do that to a friend?

Quote from: Monstarules
The rules of this website are nonexistant. Flaming, flame baiting, and many other things happen. Additionally, people do not get banned for the mentioned things on the forums. The last time there was a forum ban, I don't even remember.

I'm not sure why we have to ban people for that in the first place, we don't ban them for that ingame.  or do you want to censor both at the same time?  I'm afraid I can't get behind that.

Quote from: Monstarules
The rules for the game are even worse. The forums have adopted a forgive all policy, as long as they're (the hacker) honest. There was someone with NO LESS THAN SEVEN BAN APPEALS who was playing the game. They got banned, came here to appeal, and went on their merry way.

evidence please.  I'm not going to accept claims without evidence.  I also have a sneaking suspicion this was a one-time thing.
but I'll humor you this once, and assuming this is true, that's pretty terrible, and should obviously be stopped.  if you go through my ban appeal history, you might notice that after a few ban appeals I get fed up with their act and stop responding altogether.  I'm pretty sure most other admins do this too, so I'm not really some huge role model.

Quote from: Monstarules
The lack of rules has chased off a lot of staff and players alike. In addition to this, there are some "Veteran" staff who are often above the rules, and actively go out to troll people with their friends. The staff is in dire need of a massive overhaul, and allows inactive staff who become active again for 1 day to vote on the applications of people who need to hear back.

we have rules, though.  they're just not as strict as you'd like them to be.  no cheating (glitching, hacks), no spamming, no overly racist/sexist/etc stuff.  the last one is more subjective than the others, but as a general rule it's a pretty high set bar, as most of the staff have high tolerances for that type of stuff.  on top of that, the etc stuff is usually ironic/sarcastic anyways.
also, would overhaul = removing Komrades?  because most of the staff seem pretty ok to me...

Quote from: Monstarules
Also here's what it's like being a guard. You will be abused, and I know the situation hasn't gotten better, because I have access to the guard ban reports still. There are currently over 300 guard bans which haven't been answered. Here's what being a guard means, in a nutshell:

1. You will be used in place of admins, who will not look at your reports unless you spam the IRC, and then they get mad at you for being ambitious
2. You have literally no power over hackers who ban evade. Good luck!
3. You will be tested to the extreme when someone doesn't like you. Prepare to be trolled to the max, and prepare to deal with instances of stupid votekicks.
4. You will not go up because to go up you need to devote all 24 hours a day 7 days a week to catching hackers to even have a hope of advancing, since the staff, even the inactive staff, are considered staff until retired.
5. No matter if you do something another admin does, even for fun or to joke with a friend like they sometimes do, you're wrong
6. You have a better chance of getting an abuse report answered.
7. They don't care about what happens to you in reality.

I've numbered the points so I don't put any more quotes than necessary.

1. guards are staff too, so I'm not sure why you're upset about that. we don't get upset at guards for being ambitious, what are you talking about? we actually want that.
2. neither do we, honestly. but more on the point: that's true, but we restrict ip range banning because of the possibility of abuse. this makes a tiny bit less sense nowadays due to the slower rate of promotion, but I still agree with it.
3. I never had this as a guard, this sounds like a "you" problem.
4. I suppose I can agree with that, but how and why are non-retired semi-inactive staff relevant to this?
5. good exaggeration, I like it. why don't you provide some examples for us?
6. perhaps with MW but you can just message us directly if we don't see it, and we'll definitely respond to that, so... I don't see the problem here.
7. sorry to burst your bubble, but unless you're a really close friend with someone over the internet, or they know you IRL or something, they won't care either.  it's not a fault of the staff.  it's not even truly a fault.

Quote from: Monstarules
Typically a guard then comes under fire for not wanting to ban anyone, and if they don't pick it up, posting useless reports that don't get looked at, they get dismissed. There are staff members who try so hard to do these but even the most adamant and truly helpful staff members can't do anything about it because there are so many reports. The higher staff has started to stop caring.

MW has become less useful over time, I will say that much. again it might be a good idea to message more active admins about the reports.
am I counted in as one of the "higher staff"?

Quote from: Monstarules
Well, here you go, this is basically everything I said, simplified:
1: The staff have in the past, and from what I understand, still are turning on each other and arguing. I have access to the Aloha staff channel but I don't bother going in there again
2: Major breaches of the admin rules, committed by several staff members, unfortunately, the bulk of who are Komrades.
3: Rigging apps, people to fail, and calling in the inactive staff to trash applications.
4: Lack of rules on the forums
5: Lack of banning people like we used to
6: Guards are the equivalent of a terminal lance, but even worse. At one point I had 50 unanswered reports in the MW list.
7: Continuing that above pointer, guards are viewed as expendable and nobody wants to review their reports.
8: Continuing with pointer 3, there are staff who are veterans who cause issues and have been called out for it, yet nothing happens because of favoritism
9: The Moderators and Admins aren't doing what they need to anymore, just ask anyone on CSMaps, the Guards can't keep up with it
10: There are admins who are trying their best and nobody else wants to help them
11: The second biggest pointer, we won't expand to other games with any sort of backbone. We tried Minecraft, Terraria and more, and yet they all failed because lack of administrative support.

1. I'm in the staff channel, obviously, so.. uh.. no?
2. "Komrades" ding ding ding we have a winner.  they're actually fair and levelheaded people, you know.
3. now it's "rigging" the apps? jesus.
4. covered this
5. yes, the staff have moved to other places, and are more busy IRL.  is this really that surprising?
6. that sucks.  covered this though.
7. good job, speaking for all of the staff.  I don't view guards as expendable, and I'm pretty sure none of us do.
8. evidence please9. same as the response to 5.  it's disappointing, but unless we can find some way to get people back in this community there's nothing we can really do about this.
10. 5.
11. do not deal in absolutes!!  meh, you might be right.  this seems like a good game though: Teeworlds

Quote from: Monstarules
Oh and the biggest pointer. Several somewhat pissed off staff members who helped me build that, including BK's. That's right. MULTIPLE BK's.

sorry, I'm lost.  helped you build what?

Quote from: Monstarules
The good staff is very frustrated with this website and what it's become, and because of how the staff operates, Izzy cannot do much about it without overhauling everything, and going against what he originally said.

I'm not frustrated much at all, so please speak for yourself.  also, I don't see any reform happening.  sorry.

Quote from: Monstarules
Oh also, I can't get banned and this post cannot be deleted as it is not against the rules. This isn't a leak or a hack of information either, as I have been included in the Staff document with editing rights since 2013, and while I mentioned it, nobody took the editing rights away from me either. I did not use names, I did not talk about certain* people. I have a right to speak the truth here.

this might be a bit of a dark turn, and an unpopular opinion, but the staff have every right to delete this thread and ban you, as we make the rules.  you don't have any rights here, we're letting you voice this.  it's a good thing for everyone involved here that most of the staff believe fully in free speech. (and in case it wasn't clear, I do too)
also, you're simply wrong here.  this is a leak.  or, it would be, if a lot of this wasn't inaccurate.  most, if not all of the people in this thread have no access to that staff document, so good job.

Quote from: Monstarules
As for any arguments against this, your opinion does not matter. That's a very harsh thing to say, but everything I said above here are facts. [...] As for any Moderator or above staff who might reply "Where is the proof", I don't have to supply it because you either have access to it or you know how well this operates.

so, as member of the "good staff," can I argue against this? or is my "good staff" membership now revoked?  a lot of this stuff you've posted is exaggerated tales and extraordinary claims.
evidence please.  this is not how arguments work, you have the burden of proof.  those who make extraordinary claims must provide extraordinary evidence.

Quote from: Monstarules
To the guards, and good staff, I'm sorry.

you'd better be.

Spoiler for less important stuff:
Quote from: Monstarules
I also feel really bad for good staff members, such as MuffinTastic, Nathan, Israellee, FalleN, FerrrariFlunker, Pun, Chase, BR and Froelich131.

why isn't topo on that list?  :(

as for israelleelll's post, I can agree with most of that, as sad as it is.  though the post is a bit... extreme.

p.s. wow this is a big post.
p.p.s. a lot of this stuff should really be privately discussed, look what you did :)

February 25, 2017, 04:39:13 PM HST
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Re: BigotedBill Got Banned.... ;( oh my gosh! im not freaking lying!! You obviously have never used this macro technology before...
it spams half ur clip with 1 press. i am not lying..
bunch of no it alls can't even realise the new technology.

March 08, 2017, 02:34:48 AM HST
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Re: Is build and shoot ever coming back up? yes, the forums and all of its content/posts are coming back. as is the redesigned website. sorry about the long wait.

initially, malicious activity caused the site to go down. looking forward, we decided it would be best to revamp everything. forum data will be restored from a September 2016 backup, one day before the old site went down.

May 13, 2017, 04:25:56 PM HST
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Re: banned appeal - 9333 First of all, thank you for giving me the opportunity.

Shortly after I was banned, I immediately erased the hacking program.

Because I realized that what I did was wrong.

I promise you that I will never use it again and become a clean player.

I am really sorry for my lack of vocabulary and thank you very much for your response.


May 27, 2017, 06:56:24 PM HST
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Re: Banned for trying to protect tower i meant not to post anything but i guess i will anyway

On bridgeyard, taking down the bridge is a tactic that's been commonly used by both normal players and staff alike. You shouldn't employ different sets of rules when different admins are on or when the tactic seems noobish. I, as I'm sure many others, have been a witness (or even a part) to many bad tactics on various kinds of maps. Are people who build 3+ high walls (and who are firmly convinced it is their tactic that'ss gonna tip the balance in their team's favour, and which could potentially, although unlikely, work, granted certain conditions were met) on maps like driftice gonna get actively disabled just because you know/think those tactics are not so good? This was just one example of many others possible, and part of the game is learning. Getting to know what, how, where and why something works, and where it just doesn't. Then there is taking risks. Doing something which might seem to you like dumb shit, and which in and of itself isn’t anything malicious, is a part of that risk. That is all a part of testing various strategies, however good or bad they may be.

I am firmly convinced that toggling people based on controversial "i know better this isn't gonna work here" or "hurr durr i see the full picture" should not be the way to go, and it's a simple way to alienate many players-especially considering how minute today's playerbase is - as simply this makes the game unnecessarily restrictive and, dare I say, boring. It also makes things needlessly confusing, and what fun is a game when you have to carefully watch your every step to avoid getting banned or penalized in some way.

All I've mentioned here, stands in a glaring contradiction to what aloha supposedly is, and that is operating in the shadows, discreetly, interfering in gameplay as little as it's possible and taking actions only when absolutely necessary, and that would entail situations with visibly /malicious intent/, i.e. aimbotting, obvious griefing and shit.

So, what we need is: a uniform set of rules (however unreasonable, excessive, debatable some of them may seem), not a system where punishing seems to be done randomly, on a whim, or where certain admins punish for things to which other admins wouldn't as much as bat an eye (or in which they actively partake in).

June 26, 2017, 12:18:42 PM HST
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Re: VPN Usage
I am suggesting keeping the existing practices, and not adding some VPN ban or some forced member login VPN only.

just to clarify, you do understand that logging in would be required only for the small number of players who use VPNs, right?

And there's the thing, we are talking about people using VPNs to persistently evade their bans as if it's a 'problem' ... But is it problem? Really?

it's enough of a problem that we're exploring options such as this to help us improve the experience for the majority, yes. really.

Or is it just apart of your job?

i know you're not asking if this is literally our job, but i just want to point out that we do this out of our goodwill. we don't get paid for it, we volunteer. in fact, we even contribute our own money to keep things operational. we put in a lot of effort to try to keep things as smooth as possible for the majority because we want you to enjoy the experience so that we can also enjoy it. it's not fun for us when someone is upset.

Because I don't see Aloha servers suffering from hackers; as I said before, the admins do a pretty swift job in getting rid of any disturbances in games already.

i agree that our admins are incredible at taking care of disturbances. just because you don't see that happening doesn't mean it's magically easy. i don't expect you believe me, but there's so much more effort going into maintaining all of this than you're imagining.

Players have always used ways to evade bans... So what have you been doing for the past 5 years to combat that? What has suddenly made those methods now really difficult, to the point where we now need to suggest curbing ordinary player's access to VPN as a consequence? Because, again, I don't see this 'problem' spilling into the server affecting everyone playing. I'm all for making things easier, but not at the cost of a large portion of players being inconvenienced in accessing the server, or in some cases being unable to join.

So just like my first post, I am suggesting asking whether this really is a problem. I'm not interested in increasing or decreasing staff numbers, the great looming problem (actual problem) of lack of players is more interesting to me however.

again, a lot more than you're imagining... for 6 years, not 5, actually. that's not suddenly.

again, please consider that maybe the reason you don't see the problem is because our efforts have been so focused on providing you that luxury.

what we're trying to do is improve the efficiency of our efforts so that we can continue helping the majority of players have a normal experience. your claim that a "large portion of players would be inconvenienced" is quite exaggerated because the truth of the matter is that only a very small portion of players use VPNs and we're already thinking about ways to make it as easy as possible for them to continue playing.

considering that lack of players is such a concern to you, you should be grateful that we're proactively taking steps to curb VPN abuse.

October 25, 2017, 12:48:51 AM HST
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Re: When will I get unmute ? It's been more than 3 months.
easy to point fingers at others when there are more ppl also doing wrong.

you're pointing fingers. it's not helping you.

topo is being very reasonable...

i mentioned that i wanted to unmute you and see how you went a few weeks ago, and the majority who have weighed in so far have wanted to keep you muted until february because they don't think you can control yourself. can you? if you think you can i'm not against trying it out for a while, but i won't oppose anyone who wants to reinstate the automute if they think you've gone back to being a massive pain again

he was willing to give you another chance, he asked if you could try...

you ignored the question.

you got defensive.

you pointed fingers.

you name-called.

how is any of that helpful to you?

don't you know topo actually wanted to unmute you? all you had to do was provide a little reassurance, but you threw your opportunity away!

you're too concerned about proving yourself. sometimes it's best to just let it go...

October 31, 2017, 07:13:46 AM HST
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Racism,fake votekicking. Did /admin but no.. Player map- RUINS
Player name - Captivirus
Violation - racism, racist votekick

November 03, 2017, 04:51:58 AM HST
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Re: Reducing time of my mute Ss13,

You’ve made three appeals for this exact reason in the last month, and yet they’re all missing something very important: an apology.

The fact of the matter is, you are not muted for no reason: you have proven time and time again that you could not be trusted with the very minor privilege of speaking in our servers, as you have continually abused said privilege to make the experience of everyone around you worse.

This time, I’d like it to be different.

I’d like for you to apologize for all of the flaming, all of the nonsense, every bit of this silly charade, especially because I know you want this to be over just as much as everyone else, if not more. More importantly, I’d like you to promise that this won’t ever be a problem again, and we can just let it end here.

If you do all of those things, you will be unmuted 2 weeks from today, on January 18th. If you don’t feel like it, then I’ll see you at the end of February. And if you really decide that, after all this, you want to cause problems again? Well, in that case, speaking on our servers probably just isn’t your thing... but let’s hope we never get to that point.

I look forward to your response, and if all goes well, I look forward even more to reading those beautiful words of yours in-game again.

 ;D

P.S. Many thanks to topo for his blessing

January 03, 2018, 07:39:56 PM HST
1